Coffee Talk #13: Should Price Be a Factor in Review Scores?

Welcome to Coffee Talk! Let’s start off the day by discussing whatever is on your (nerd chic) mind. Every morning I’ll kick off a discussion and I’m counting on you to participate in it. If you’re not feelin’ my topic, feel free to start a chat with your fellow readers and see where it takes you. Whether you’re talking about videogames, your pick for the World Series, D&D nerds using Google Wave, or electric scooters, Coffee Talk is the place to do it.

So many of my friends in the gaming business are raving about DJ Hero. During several casual chats this week, I heard superlative after superlative thrown at the game. Most of the time, I just nodded and grinned (or in some cases did the IM equivalent of nodding and grinning). To the friends I was comfortable with — the ones close enough to engage in a healthy debate with, that is — I responded with one simple question, “Yeah, but is it worth $120?”

DJ Hero Renegade Edition

Price is a factor when you’re buying a game, but for some reviewers it’s a non-issue. Some outlets take the stance of “we judge each game on its own merits”. I don’t really buy that. I have different expectations from a full-budget $60 game than a $20 value title or a $10 download. Although some reviewers are taking DJ Hero’s price into consideration, I don’t think they’re weighing it into the equation as heavily as they ought to.

Part of the problem is that some longtime reviewers get too used to being able to play every game that’s released for free. They forget about being a kid that desperately wanted three games, but had to deliberate for days because they could only afford one. To me, a game like DJ Hero or Rock Band or Guitar Hero should be looked at differently than a $60 game because they’re frickin’ expensive.

Of course, that’s just my opinion. I want to know what you think America. Should a game’s price be considered in its review score?

Author: RPadTV

110 thoughts on “Coffee Talk #13: Should Price Be a Factor in Review Scores?”

  1. yeah it only makes sense to me to factor in the price of a game when you review it, like you said ray you have different expectations from different priced games. The XBLA games that I might download for $5-$15 have much different expectations as far as quality and amount of time I will spend playing them, and whether I can let some of the quality of gameplay slide due to how much I am paying.

    In the case of DJ Hero, I would love to have that game, but that is too expensive for me for just one game and for a peripheral that can only be used with that game. Guitar Hero is a little different because (even if I would have paid full price for my guitars) I can use the guitars for all five of my Guitar Hero series games.

    Games need to be looked at in comparison to other games in their price level. Anything I buy from XBLA is on a different review scale for me than any $60 game, it would be crazy to expect the same quality all around from both places.

  2. I understand including the price in a review. However you would have to weigh it against similarly priced games. It's a double edged sword really. You should just judge the game, but with these damn music games the quality of the peripherals have to be considered in the final judgement.

    On the other hand, someone who is interested in something like DJ Hero knows full well the cost involved to get the game. So the review of how well the game is doesn't need to include the price.

    Conversely if we are going to factor in price to a review does that mean a $15 game that is awesome should receive a higher score than a regular priced title since it is cheaper? Should the cheap game be judged more liberal? Reviews are the necessary evil in all entertainment.

  3. halo odst

    got good reviews from most places, so the campaign aspect of odst certainly seemed to be on par with the other halo games. The question is, is a new halo campaign alone worth 60 bucks? I personally dont think so, but that being said, it should have no impact to the review

    if a game is a 5 out of 5 or whatever, thats what it is…thats like asking the people who are responsible for rating the safety of vehicles to lower their score based on sticker price

    if a car is safe, its safe..its up to the consumer to make the decision whether its actually worth the money or not,

    If modern warfare 2 was a thousand dollars, its still gonna be a great game, right? No one will buy it, but itll be great nonetheless

  4. @ray

    be honest

    do you think it was pretty whack for g4 to get mr sark to the review of odst?

  5. @topic – it should be mentioned in the review and part of the final score. A very big part of any review should be it's "judged" worth to the consumer. It's great that GH:Smash Hits redoes a lot of the great songs from the earlier additions for band play, but is it a buy worth $60.

    My roommate brought home the Renegade edition of DJ Hero last night (as I believe he woudl after he came back like a loonatic from his Best Buy trip this weekend) and we had a fun time with. I can say with utmost assurance from my POV, I would not have spent the money on it. While fun, the sound track and not the gameplay is the best part of the game. I am a fan of the GH and Rockband series because of the appeal that drumming has to me; it was something that I found really difficult in the beginning because of a lack of coordination and general rhythm, but I kept at it because I wanted to drum. There just isn't that need associated with this game for me, especially at a $120 price point.

  6. @Ray – this topic is a great example on why reviews should drop the points and go for a buy/maybe/no buy system. Keep it simple, keep it focused on fun and value.

  7. @Thunder

    I have to agree with the Sark thing. He put on a glowing review for an average game. I guess I should have taken note that only a die-hard fan would get more than a few hours of fun out of the game.

  8. I agree completely Ray. even if it was Uncharted 2 or Mass Effect 2 I would seriously wonder how good the game was if it cost that much. hell, for that kind of money you should be able to play the game without a game system at all.

    After completing 2 rounds of Dragon Age Journeys I realized the potential problem with this whole EA thing. after playing the game asking me if I would have paid for it is an asinine thing to do. I should of known this was a test product to see if people would actually play/pay for a game like this. hell, at under an hour play time on the second run through it's little more than an RPG demo if you ask me

  9. Price does effect the consumers satisfaction with a game. ODST is proof of concept. There are many people who will say the game 'teh sucks' because it isn't worth $60, even though it is a great game. I try to judge my games based on the time I spent enjoying the game, in hours, per dollar spent on the game. So far Tales of Symphonia, Halo:CE, Halo 2, and MW1 are the best games based on that scale and honestly, I can't disagree with those choices no matter what scale I try to use instead.

  10. Price should be a factor in the initial review of a game. But since not everyone lives at the same income standard it is still subjective. I mean yeah a mediocre game may only cost $10, but I have had times when $10 was too much to pay for anything besides gas to make it to work. Some people have no problem throwing around $10, $20, $60 in a week to get what they want. It would just be hard to tell someone what something with me "worth" to them.

  11. @thunder – Mr Sark was not the only person to give ODST a glowing review. I thought the SP was a lot better than Halo 3 personally and I would pay $60 again for it.

  12. @ Slicky, I think the reviewer owes it to the readers to tell them how much entertainment value they are going to get for the money. I always know an RPG game is going to be some of the most hours and fun I'll get out of $60. And I always know an FPS is going to be the shortest bit of fun I get out of it.

    Let the readers know but people should be able to make their own guesses based on their income and desire for the game.

    And don't anyone say this is an investment and will work with DJ hero 2, 3 and all that. Activision will create a new turntable that will be just a bit better every time

  13. Fallout 3 was worth the $80 (or whatever it was with the Lunchbox) I paid for it on release. Heck I have considered giving away my original copy to buy the $60 GOTY Edition. But considering I have gotten well over 100 hours of game play in that isn't bad. I have 23 hours into Uncharted 2 already, Games like Crackdown, EDF 2017, BioShock, inFAMOUS and Halo 3 are all games that I have 50+ hours on them and I would even pay to replace them.

  14. @shockwave

    yeah thats cool, i just personally dont think that game was worth 60 bucks, just my opinion

    but then again i hate halo games, so im biased. But like i said, that opinion should not be taken into consideration when a game is being reviewed…they should definitly mention that during the review, but a good game is a good game, regardless of length or lack of multiplayer or whatnot

  15. @sandrock

    yeah ive got like 25 days in myself

    101,000 kills or something….1.55 k/d ratio

    thats not great or anything, i actually kind of suck at it now…too many god damn campers

  16. but what sandrock said is exactly why i dont think ANY shooter would be worth 60 bucks without multiplayer

    whether it be odst, mw2, whatever…..we have been spoiled, the days of campaign only shooters are done

  17. @Shockwave

    You are right the reviewer should tell them about how much entertainment value is in a game, but no matter what anyone or even most everyone says there is still a possibility it just won't be for you even if it sounded like it would. A review can only be given so much weight because ultimately it is up to the consumer. That's why I firmly believe in renting, although DJ Hero is an example of something you'd have to just buy and that sucks.

  18. @Slicky, I agree on FPS games. although they are usually little more than 10 hours I just suck it up for 60 bucks. If it's a really good game hopefully I'll get to play it 2 or 3 times on harder difficulty levels for added value

    @thunder – thanks for understanding, although I will agree on the fan thing. I think several reviews of ODST said "hey, if you don't like Halo don't bother" I will agree with you though that Sark was definitely not the best person to review it. It should have been Sessler

  19. @Thunder

    I know and it sucks. Sometimes I can get into MP. I'll fire up Bad Company, COD4 or Uncharted 2. But then something will happen a ruin it all for me. Sometimes its just my schedule that keeps me from enjoying MP, I won't have time for a full course of maps. On Bad Company about 2 weeks ago. Each time I spawned I had about half a second to move before I was blown away by 3 guys spawn camping, they were able to wipe out our entire team. Why even play then?

  20. @ Slicky, I think we are both the exception. but I always preferred LAN multiplayer and Co-op to online. I can't stand obnoxious people online.

    F'n tough kids who talk trash just because they have the safety of the internet. They wouldn't be talking sh*t if they were in front of me.

    Another reason I don't play online games is that I never play online enough to get really good. I hate being the noob on the battlefield but I never put enough MP hours in to get good

  21. Also, seeing as I hate MP online gaming I also hate MP achievements. they ruin my gamerscore. lol

  22. @Shockwave562

    Yeah, but people still pretend Microsoft pays Sessler. It doesn't matter who reviews it because if the review is good and has to do with an exclusive, all the fangirls will get their panties in a bunch. (Should I downgrade fanboys more to fanschoolgirls?) Plus, if Sark had been biased, then don't you think Sessler would have made him tone it down. Also, Sark said if you aren't a fan of Halo then this game isn't for you. (counter proof to being a biased review)

  23. @Sandrock – I think you have a lot of points.

    I think it's unfortunate that people hate Crackdown, Halo, or Mass Effect or talk bad about them just because they are exclusives.

    Same thing happens with the PS3. people talk trash about LBP, MGS4, and Uncharted 2 just because they aren't for their system. it sucks

  24. I'm not throwing Thunder in the mix because I believe he has played Halo and just doesn't like it. That game is a hate it/love it sort of game.

    but a lot of people never even play a game and like to talk about how terrible it is and that irks me

  25. @Shockwave

    Yeah it is hard to play ANY MP game after it has been out a while, when you come in a as level 1 while everyone just kills you. They know all of the hiding spots and sniping points while I run around just trying to find anyone to shoot.

    I don't know what has made Uncharted's Mp so likable to me though, I just have really been enjoying it. Well I haven't played it but twice since the game released, but I played the hell out of the Beta.

  26. Hey quick Help question. This may be dumb and I may be missing something obvious, but a co-worker brought me a song (Tony and Dawn Knock 3 Times) and they want part of it as a ringtone. I clipped the part they want with Nero Wave editor, but the file is still nearly 1.5mb and their phone won't accept it. Anyway to make it smaller?

  27. lol Slicky, me too. I've been so wrapped up in SP but I did love the beta. I probably will get a few more rounds in of mp on that game.

    I like Uncharted cause I don't even have to put a headset on I can just jump in and kill people

  28. @slicky

    their phone will only accept wav format sound?

    you could turn it into mp3 and it would be a hell of a lot smaller…..

  29. @shockwave

    yeah ive played halo, and i actually think halo and halo 2 are pretty good games, i just HATE the multiplayer component of them, and i suck at them

    i just wont buy a fps unless it either has multiplayer or is massive, such as a gta or a fallout….although i realise neither of those qualify as fps' in the technical sense

  30. @Thunder

    The original song came to me as an MP3. Her phone can accept MP3. When I clipped the song and saved it back as an MP3 it is exactly the same size as the original but it is only 29 seconds of the song.

  31. Nevermind got it. I had to copy the 29 seconds I wanted and paste it into a new track file by itself. it was apparently keeping the original data attached to it.

  32. @ thunder – anymore I agree. I think one of the reasons I still play Halo is that it is one of the few FPSs I will buy anymore. straight FPS with no RPG is just growing tired for me. I didn't care for KZ2 much and I don't care what people say, Modern warefare is still the same game it was back when COD2 came out at the 360 launch. just because the time is different doesn't mean the core game isn't the same.

    Now give me some RPG elements like Bioshock and Fallout 3 and now we're talking. hell, Uncharted 2 puts almost any FPS to shame. This is why I'd like to get Borderlands

    I think I'll soon be wrapping up the straight FPS part of my life. Halo is the one I'm hanging on to for some odd reason

  33. thats weird….exact same size? i would keep messing around with nero SE, see if the option is there to reduce the bitrate before converting

    n8r would know

  34. ok, you got it


    when it comes to games, one persons trash is anothers treasure….my all time favorite 2d fighting game is, and always will be, the original samurai showdown

    you liking halo says nothing about you personally, its just not my bag

    neither are swedish made penis enlargers, despite the reciept you may have noticed, or the autobiographical book that may or may not state otherwise

  35. @thunder – I definitely agree with that. games like many other things in this world are in the eye of the beholder right?

    I really just think i'm sick of straight FPS but Halo is this childhood (well teen at least) memory I'm hanging on to. I'm hoping it will evolve a bit when Reach comes out next year. I do tend to get bored doing the same things over and over again.

    On another note is anyone here excited about Boondock Saint's 2. anyone here think it will be terrible? I just don't know what to think yet

  36. I am totally not looking forward to it. I doubt it will be able to live up to the original. The other day I noticed a Green Street Hooligans 2, and I just had to pass. I love the first movie, but I fel like they can't redo it any better and I refuse to partake.

    Boondock Saints – I love the entire scene where they are picking out equipment and giving each other crap about the Knife and rope.

  37. When we write reviews for our site, we absolutely keep the price in mind. Mind you, we've only gotten a couple of review copies at this point as we're growing the site. The majority of stuff we review out of our own pocket. So maybe that's why we keep it more in mind while other sites don't.

  38. @RROD

    For value, strong online helps alot. However, Halo:CE has no online and I've put many hours into that game. The only Halo I actually put any real amount of time into the multiplayer was 2. ODST and 3 I played for the campaign and not the multiplayer, but the value is lower in those because I can't get anyone to play coop like I did for CE and 2. Coop is a good way to spend a, normally single player, story/campaign and adds more replay value to a game. I guess I just prefer social gaming in general instead of sitting in a room by myself and talking to no one.

  39. The problem with factoring price/value into reviews is that price is variable. For a review to stand the test of time, it has to either take price changes into account, or ignore it all together.

    A review might say that ODST wasn't worth $60, but what about a few months from now if it's going for $40 or even less? You have to think about it in the other direction too. A lot of reviews praised GTA: Lost and Damned for its price point. But now you can get Episodes from Liberty City for $40. This isn't really a good deal for someone who bought Lost and Damned when it came out. But I know many people would prefer to own a physical disk rather than a download.

  40. BF 1943 I logged close to 300 hours in it. Great value.

    I bought Diablo2 and the expansion. Probably close to 1k hours.

    Just putting that out there.

    Geaux Saints!!

  41. @Shockwave562 i am not really looking to Boondock Saints 2 to be that great. the first one was a decent one watch movie for me, but that was about it.

  42. Since ODST keeps coming up, I'm gonna link my review just so you can see how we broke it down. The game got an 8.5. Was the $60 price point a consideration in that score? Absolutely:

    The cliff notes version:

    Ultimately, we did mention that the campaign was short. However, multiplayer (this case Firefight) was the real selling point of the game. And the thing about Multiplayer is that different people will get different amounts of play out of multiplayer games, thus making it very hard to judge the true worth of the game.

    Although I really liked Firefight, I might never play it again because it's hard to get online with my friends who all live on the East Coast. I can't play something that's somewhat violent in front of my son. That's why I sent my Gamefly rental back even though I really liked the game and toyed with the idea of keeping it.

    But I'll see friends online playing it for the next year at least. And for those people who didn't buy all the DLC map packs from Halo 3, including them all with the game along with 3 new ones was a great bonus.

  43. boondock saints has a cult following

    i havent drank the kool aid though

    although i liked billy connelly in it….

  44. Anyone know if the PS3 version of BF 1943 ever got enough kills to unlock the other map?

  45. a game that is worth 60 bucks is an RPG. Demon's souls is worth the 60 bucks. Valkyria chronicles, disgaea, the las remnant, mass effect, dragon age!!!!(NEXT WEEK!!!!!), and so many rpgs out there! ZOMG!!!

  46. The thing about Boondock Saints is this:

    Is it a great movie? No.

    Is it an extremely quotable movie? Hell Yes.

    That's why most of my friends really liked it. Some of the lines are just flat out funny as hell. The ending gets a little strange, and tends to lose me every time, because the movie suddenly gets a lot more serious than the first 3/4's, which is just great.

  47. @Boondock – the movie was entertaining, not great, but definently worth the 2 hrs I spent watching it. I was able to call the Billy Connely relations way to early for my wife's taste. Very quotable though, and I think Willem Dafoe steals the show as the Non-Cuddle Homosexual Cop. Not quite sure what they are going to do with two, I thought the way the first one ended kind of sewed everything up nicely…

    @Multiplayer – I was never a big fan of multiplayer outside of mmo's until Uncharted 2. Not being very good at shooters to being with, the platforming and run/gun aspect of it really appeals to me. Haven't done the co-op yet, though I would be more the willing to give it a shot if anyone wants to. PSN id is LarcenousLaugh as well. Send me a friend req and we can set something up.

    @swedishmadepenisenlargers – My middle name is Danger.

  48. Just finished all the Dragon Age Journeys stuff so I got all the unlockables. I really don't know that it was really worth it but it was a pretty fun game

  49. @Nightshade386

    The point I was making with ODST was that reviews that considered the $60 price tag wouldn't be as relevant when the price drops.

    Reviews are supposed to help people decide if they want to try a game. They shouldn't be used to reaffirm peoples' opinions. If the price can affect how someone feels about a game, and the price is going to be a variable, then it shouldn't be considered.

  50. @empyu. I think if the reviewer mentions price in the review it is relevent. if they say "at $60 you might not have enough reasons to buy this game"

    but hey, you see it for 20 bucks on Amazon, then you're good to go. I would love to know if a game is a wait game. I feel that way about Mirror's Edge. I'm going to get it now cause I can for like $18. I don't think it was worth 60

  51. @Smartguy

    If you want something done right, I see we have to do it ourselves. I'll see you Monday night.

  52. @Shockwave562

    If they say it in the context that a lower price is a better value, then it's fine. But if they simply say the game isn't worth it, then people might get the impression that the game isn't worth buying at any price.

  53. @Empyu: Price is fair game. Every game will eventually go down in price, but when writing a review you have to consider the current price point. You also can't really consider special deals like the GH5/GHVH deal Activision ran for a month because a lot of people are going to have to pay a full $60 for GHVH (or more if they buy a new instrument to go with it).

  54. I think price ought to be mentioned, but not featured. I think sometimes it should be mentioned but really only if something is stunningly overvalued or undervalued. Like, if a game that makes you pick up a ton of peripheral equipment to play it — equipment that has no other use than for the game — it should be worth the cost of equipping for it. Especially when you figure the bargain that is proposed is — hey this is going to cost a lot, but the experience of using creative peripherals and playing this game is worth it. I guess what I am saying is that price ought to be a consideration if the game makes it a selling point by pricing way low or if it costs an unnaturally high amoung (like over 75 bucks).

    Other than that, I think gamers expect to pay within a certain range, and are not really that driven by whether it's a 39.99 title or 59.99 — especially since there is such a huge secondary market.

    maybe i'm wrong though, maybe I'm too old and rich now to undertand how much 20 bucks means to the kids right now.

    Pretty amazing that most games cost 3 packs of smokes in NYC. I bet it was a 10/1 ratio in the 90s even.

    I wonder if the taxing really raises the value of cigarettes in prison.

    Provocative topic today!

  55. @RROD and Smartguy – When you are the Dolphins, blowing an impressive lead is like second nature. Being a lifelong Dolphins fan, my first though at their being up 24-3 was not "wow I hope they can keep this up" but "I see this ending badly…"

    On the Shula-Marino Choke Scale, this easily ranked up at about an 8. (1 being any game during the Cam Cameron era, 10 being That-Monday-Night-Game-Against-Jets-That-Cannot-Be-Named).

  56. @RROD

    I don't think it looks too good for the Falcons on Monday night. Saints put up plenty of points on Monday nights.

  57. lol. i love it how RRODishere goes to g4tv and badmouths anything that is 360. it just pisses everyone off, its not that i dont like you man, much respect, like all the other guys in here.

  58. @rbee90

    I still play my RRODisBack character over on the Feed, but here I'm RRODisHere who's not a fanboy. ;)


    Honestly, I love my Falcons but that love doesn't make me turn a blind eye to our problems. We haven't got our running game going yet and our defense has holes. I don't know how we can stop the Saints from scoring 40 points and without a running game we won't be able to match those points. We need a miracle, but any given Sunday I guess.

  59. @RROD

    i know, i just find it hilarious. lol. thefeed is getting boring though. i usually forgt visiting there anymore, i go here, to kotaku, and destrucoid for news.

  60. @RROD

    I think the points can be really high in this one. It is a division game though, and those are always tougher than usual. I don't know if the Saints will sweep Atlanta, but I think they take this one in NOLA and perhaps drop the one in Atlanta. At least the NFC South is strong.

    Also, I think I might go over to thefeed and become your xbox nemesis. maybe we'll get banned.

  61. im sorry if my grammar is way off today, its cause im doing my math homeowrk and writing coments at the same time

  62. im with rbee90 about thefeed. i visit G4 every once in a while to check up on things, but now all i do anymore is come here and go to gamekicker which i also really like. G4 has been watered down fora long time though and has been pushing me away. Im a senior in college now and all that is on G4 anymore is Cops and Cheaters with the occasional video game show. My freshman year there was always something new on like Cheat! or X-play or AOTS all day, with some other tech stuff thrown in the mix. Now it's hardly tech related 90% of the time.

  63. @Smartguy

    I wouldn't call the NFC South strong when the Bucs are still winless and the Panthers only having 1 win.

    Bring it on. We'll give them hell.

  64. @Nightshade386

    Is it really okay to say a good story is worth so much but a bad camera angle drops the value of a game? Reviews should be about a person's total experience within a game. Paying for it is just a very small part of that experience.


    I think you have the right idea. I don't mind if reviewers factor the price of games in their reviews. They just have to specifically say that they feel the way they do about a game because of the price.

    I just feel if price becomes too important, developers will take notice and start making cheaper games. As much as I don't like that game prices are going up, I'd hate to see big budget titles disappear and be replace by cheaper downloaded games.

  65. @Empyu

    A bad camera angle can ruin a game with a good story, just like a high price tag can ruin a good game. People don't take a game for just what they see on screen, everything that involves the game is added to the games experience. This includes buying it, talking about it, selling it, and even taking it out of the case. Every time you think about a game, that is part of the consumer experience.

  66. I can’t stand Online Multiplayer especially Online ONLY MP!! I wish they would drop it from games or keep it as an afterthought. I play FPS for the Fun of playing. I just get tired of people on MP. I wish no one could communicate with others because I get tired of hearing peoples dogs barking or kids sitting in the room watching me play while someone cusses up a storm. Or especially godawful music blaring in the back ground.

  67. @ Smartguy

    That's right you said conference… however just because old man Favre lost to a better team in nail-biting fashion doesn't mean he sucks all of a sudden. The guy truly does have a heap of experience and leads that team well. And then there's Eli.

    @ RROD

    It's about time you came out of hiding.

    @ the Slicky/Thunder song thing

    I'm not exactly sure what the software in question is. If it's coming in as a .wav, you need to export that into something that can convert it, and then back to mp3. You will lose hella bitrate in the process though.

  68. @N8R

    It came as an MP3 and I cut out the portions she didn't want but the file remained the same size. When I tried to down sample it I got an error (don't know for sure what I was even doing there). Then I found that if I copied the part she wanted into a new file it came out to 283kb. Still don't know what happened for sure but now she has Knock 3 Times as a ring tone.

  69. @ Slicky

    It really depends on the software you're using to sample. I just use Garageband to do all of that.

    It sounds like you figured out a usable method however. As long as the end result is what you want… so be it.

  70. @N8R

    I don't deal with that stuff much and I just use what came with my Nero 7, Nero WaveEditor. Ringtones are about the only thing I have ever found it useful for. I guess it works okay I just hate fumbling through it.

  71. @N8R

    I didn't forget about Favre. A living legend who has been a winner for 2 decades, much like Elway. I was trying to give legitimacy to the south division was all.

    I think Brees is on top with Peyton and Brady right now if not a bit better this season.

  72. @Sandrock323

    I agree with you that the consumer experience goes beyond just playing the game, but I wouldn't put too much weight on stuff like price, customer service, etc. Can you really compare the value of acting between GTA4 and Uncharted2? Can you honestly say the control scheme of Call of Duty holds more value than any other FPS?

    I understand that a high price tag makes some games undesirable, but you have to admit that not all people consider it as a factor when buying games. If a reviewer takes price to be an important factor, he should let his readers/listeners know because it means he may be judging the game in a manner that doesn't fit everyone's expectations.

  73. @Empyu

    I heard many times last gen about poor controls being the prime factor in why a game wasn't worth buying. But at the same time, you never here about the controls being so great that you should buy a game. Price is similar, it can't make a game be great, but it can make it bad/grey. Plus, reviewers should always list every important, and most minor, reasons why they feel a game should get the score/review it did. If money is not a concern of theirs, then they shouldn't put it in there as it isn't part of their experience with the game.

  74. @Sandrock

    Good controls are expected. If the controls aren't good or adequate then it bears mentioning, otherwise if left unstated then the consumer assumes the controls are indeed adequate. The only conclusions left after that are "which controller would be best for this game?" and that question is something relative to the enduser and can't be addressed in a review. For example: I like to play FPS on my 360 because the sticks are staggered and are further apart. That is the only reason. If something so relative was put into a review then it would discredit the critique.

    Price shouldn't be mentioned unless it is a real bargain. Again this is relative. Some people might here that an RPG has 80 hours of gameplay at $60 and consider it a bargain. However bargain has traditionally meant some lagniappe for a lower price.

  75. @ Smartguy

    No, the dude in France in the 1700's who became the urban legend known as the Wolfman, or the Bog-man, or the Boogieman.

    I only know very little about the guy and I'm anxious to see what the History Channel has dug up.

    He killed like 117 people.

  76. Ah. I thought you were trying to sneak Wolfman Jack in on us with the DJ Hero topic and all. Damn, I really over analyzed that.

  77. @ rbee

    It just ended, but it's on again at 10:00 PST

    Right now on History is Monsterquest talking about werewolf sightings all over Wisconsin.

  78. So I was thinking about companies "remaking" games. Bionic Commando Rearmed was a great game. They did an awesome job of sticking to the original format, but it looked great and played great. The more ambitious full-blown redo of the series Bionic Commando was craptacular.

    Sony is going to "remake" God of War 1 & 2 in glorious HD. I think its a great idea to bring the games into the current generation and hopefully boost sales of God of War 3 and PS3s.

    But how far do you decide to take a remake? At what point should they have just started a new IP so that people don't come in with any preconceived notions? Can remaking all games into HD games resell them?

  79. It helps, but I think it all depends on the game. Capcom has certainly had a ton of success with the series they have thrown back out to the public HD wise (SF v Cap, SF2 HD Remix). Nostalgia is a weird thing. I bought FFVII of PSN a while ago thinking that I would love to replay it… but the controls ended up being so clunky and the graphics so poor on the HD set that I turned it off and never went back.

  80. @slicky

    Good question. Let me take a crack at it. I think that if you redo any nostalgic media in a current format or high end format it will sell. In the examples of God of War, those games looked damn good to begin with so adding an HD filter or upconvert shouldn't be that expensive and or time consuming.

    Me personally though, I prefer new IPs. I don't really get excited for sequels. There are exceptions though. I am genuinely excited for Diablo 3. I was excited for Gears 2 simply because I wanted a new game, not because it was a great game. I really wish fresh IPs sold better than the sequels that children and sheep continue to want and buy. Last generation I think new IPs were abundant, I don't see that many this time around.

  81. @larcenous

    I keep thinking that I am for sure going to buy the God Of War remakes, but I have the original discs still and a PS3 that will play them. But you are right its the Nostalgia of the game.

    I buy lots of games based purely on nostalgia. I bought the Capcom Collection (don't remember which one) just because it had the game GUNSMOKE in it. I bought the Sega collection more recently for Altered Beast and I bought Rampage World Tour on the PSN, because really who doesn't like eating people and crushing buildings.

  82. DOOM 3 was one of those games they should have just called it something else. Because Sometimes you just can't 1up a classic. Doom 3 was okay, it was beautiful, but I just didn't enjoy the game play that much.

  83. @Smartguy

    New IPs are what keep me gaming and sequels are what tide me over. Yes I want to play the new Ratchet and Clank and Yes Uncharted 2 has been spectacular, but it is always refreshing to see new IPs emerge and challenge current game standards and succeed.

    TimeShift seemed like it had a great idea involving manipulating time to complete tasks (although Blinx did it better), but clunky controls and too many constraints on the Time Shifting basically killed the game.

  84. @Slicky – I remember trying to beat Rampage on the NES, and always getting like 3/4 of the way through the US before having to go somewhere or stop for some reason.

    @NewIPs – the new innovative games are the ones that keep things interesting, though it's awesome when a lot of sequels seem to really be setting the bar higher. Uncharted 2 is completely enjoyable, on top of the single player I don't think I have had as much fun with a multiplayer title. Ratchet and Clank has me interested as well, though I haven't played any of the other ones, so I may just have to down Tools and Quest off the PSN one of these weekends.

    I think games that are also able to capture our love of nostalgia while offering something completely different are great as well. Shadow Complex, while I haven't purchased it yet (it's on the list), really reminds me of the old school metroids and contras, and I can't wait to go explore it's depths.

  85. Last night my younger brother and I were watching X-Play and they showed Zombie's Ate My Neighbors, he commented on how it looked and played like Fester's Quest, I said not really so we looked up a video and I found this:

    It cracked me up. I forgot just how dumb that game was until that video. Also there was a brief clip of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, the part where you had to swim through that electrified stuff to disarm some bombs. I miss some of the old school games.

  86. That ninja turtles game was ridiculously. I rememebered spending hours trying to get through the maze of electric seaweed with a timer to disarm bombs. Good lord. Another of those old school games I never reached the end of.

  87. @larcenous

    i was one of the rare people who was geniunely good at that ninja turtles game, the seaweed level didnt ever really bother me. There were just 2 parts of that game that i found tough

    theres a part before you fight the giant mouser where you have to fall through little holes in the floor before spiked walls closed in on you, that got me so many times

    I never did beat the game though, i got to the last hallway before shredder, and there were these astronaut space guys that shot scrolls at you that always kicked my ass

    what im saying is if the seaweed pissed you off, be glad you never got further into that game. Whenever people tell me they beat that game, i know they were lying

  88. another game i hated was friday the 13th for the nes, did that game even have an ending?

    top gun was also crazy difficult

  89. yeah I had one of those 100 NES GAMES REVEALED hint books that kind of spelled out the rest of the TMNT game for me… I was quite happy with my seaweed deaths after that.

    I don't think there was an ending to Friday the 13th, and that's not for lack of trying. I remember spending so much time lost in one of caves around crystal lake, just jumping over wolves and rats trying to find something to beat Jason. Also, the camp house layouts were designed by blind people…

  90. @Thundercracker I didn't have a problem with him reviewing the game. I just think he could have done a much better job. He's a great personality, knows his shooters, and is a fantastic player, but I don't know too much about him when it comes to writing reviews to serve an audience.

  91. @ Thundercracker

    I beat Friday the 13th (with the Game Genie). You fought the head of Jason's mom at the end.

    People who beat TMNT probably used the Game Genie as well. I also used a Gameshark to get the Egyptian level on Goldeneye multiplayer.

  92. I beat Blaster Master and Fester's Quest on my NES. Old school hard way.

    Sadly I never beat Gunsmoke though.

  93. The hardest game I remember for NES was the original Metal Gear. I remember renting it, listening to a long walkie talkie conversation, going down one screen, going down to the next screen, dying, and repeat.

    I took it back quickly. I have the rom of it now, maybe I should try it with save state files and more experience.

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