Welcome to Coffee Talk! Let’s start off the day by discussing whatever is on your (nerd chic) mind. Every morning I’ll kick off a discussion and I’m counting on you to participate in it. If you’re not feelin’ my topic, feel free to start a chat with your fellow readers and see where it takes you. Whether you’re talking about videogames, balloon boy, the new info on that FFXIII chick, or advanced sock-organization techniques, Coffee Talk is the place to do it.
For many enthusiast gamers, Nintendo has gone from a lovable loser to a disdained winner. Longtime gamers professed their love for the company while it was struggling during the Nintendo 64 and GameCube eras. Now that the Wii has Nintendo enjoying record success, a lot of the same people have turned their backs on it. Why is that? Is it an abandonment thing? Sure, the company has had tremendous success with the mainstream audience, but it’s still serving up Marios and Zeldas and Metroids for enthusiasts.
As someone that follows the business, I’m all for the Nintendo Renaissance. It was unexpected and made the market really interesting. As a gamer, I’m happy that the company is enjoying great success. The millions of casual gamers that bought Wii consoles will help make sure that I get new Pokemons, Zeldas, etc. I seem to be in the minority though. A lot of the comments I read at TheFeed (and a few that I’ve seen here) were full of anti-Wii and anti-Nintendo venom. Perhaps it’s entirely fueled by nostalgia, but I don’t see how anyone can hate Nintendo. All I have to do is think about a game like The Wind Waker to get warm fuzzies (of the gaming variety).
On this wonderful Friday, I want to know why you feel that way you to about the Wii. Has the console changed you opinion of Nintendo? Do you feel like the company abandoned you? Or did you just outgrow it?
P.S. Thanks to everyone that visited the site this week! I’m truly honored that y’all came by to read and comment and participate. While it still has a long ways to go, I was surprised by the numbers — definitely exceeded my expectations. Special thanks to N8R for the big nudge!
the wii is a fad, its marketed to children and older folks, its not a console that people really play
wii fit? is that a game?
im not hating on nintendo, they are brilliant…but its apples and oranges…ive never in my life met a person over 20 who plays the wii regularly
am i the only one awake?
It's kinda like when your girlfriend cheats on you, but you keep finding an excuse to keep going out. That's how Nintendo's new business model kinda feels to most of the hardcore gamers. Frankly I'd argue that they started cheating on us behind back in the N64 days and have been trying to push us away ever since, while throwing us the occasional Mario bone to keep us quiet.
Well, no more. We're not gonna take it anymore. It's not cheating if we're not going out anymore, and Nintendo's been dumped by most of us at this point.
im actually still gonna go to toys r us for the buy 2 get one deal
looking for a free game
has anyone played buzz? is that a fun game?
The Wii just didn't cut it for me. I was hesitant at first to buy the Gamecube and I was a huge fan of the 64. Zelda is what brings me back to Nintendo. On the gamecube I made fun of windwaker until I tried it. I actually really liked that game a lot. Super Mario Sunshine was not at all the glory of Mario 64.
This brings us to the Wii. I wanted one so bad when it came out and I couldn't find one. My roommate ended up getting one and very quickly I realized most of the games on there are crap. even the good ones like Boom Blox and wii sports are just a niche, they are fun for about 20 minutes by yourself and then they get old. It really is a party system. Then there was Zelda. I was fortunate enough to play it. but I gotta be honest. after playing games like Oblivion Zelda just doesn't cut it for me anymore. I'm just going to have to remember Zelda in the good old days like 64 and SNES.
Nintendo sold me out with the wii.
I dont hate on Nintendo.I am disappointed that they are catering mostly to the casual market,but they are making money hand over fist.I cant blame them for going after that.I just hope they invest some of those riches into some great new hardware and software for the core audience.Their older players that enjoy the Wii might not be alive for the next console :) j/k.Also people like to root/support the underdog,and they are a long ways from that now.I havent really been a big fan of NIN since Snes somewhat N64.In the end I wish them the best.They have kind of become their own thing though.If you want a gaming console it seems you 2 choices.One last thing I hope they drop this trend with all the peripherals.Getting to be ridiculous,but they are making a killing on those also so……
Also, I don't think the motion controls on the wii are all that amazing. it works for wii sports but games like COD are just worse, really. I was excited about punch out until someone told me that using motion controls would be way too hard. On Super Mario Galaxy, I watched my friend play it but I never had any interest in playing it. same with paper mario or 2d mario… when I play Mario and Zelda I want it to be games from my childhood I guess anymore.
On a side note I can't get enough of Uncharted. wow this game is amazing. I'm hanging on by every chapter and am having a hard time putting it down. Uncharted 1 just doesn't compare to this game. I'm amazed to see such a vast improvement of a game on a sequel in the same generation of consoles. I think Kotor is my favorite single player experience of all time thanks to the story but this game could be coming up close
hell not even my little sister will play her wii anymore because shes just done with its shake and waggle mini games. i only play it when a game worth playing comes out for the wii [once in 3 blue moons]
I think we'll even see the casual gamer begin to neglect their wiis [like my lil sister has] and nintendo will be back at square one… but with all of its current success, that may not happen for another year IMHO.. but what do i know?
I grew up with my NES, then SNES which still has some great games too, I bought into the 64, but right around the time the Gamecube came out and they ruined Zelda with Windwaker I haven't liked Nintendo as much. They last true game on Nintendo I liked was probably Eternal Darkness. Now I hate them for making such a technologically inferior products that sells better than those stupid Ug boots. The Wii has let so much CRAP software onto the market. Its like games on your cell phone, cheap and crappy, something to show to friends but never really fun by yourself.
i dont know why 2d games had to die
i miss the old side scrollers, like contra, rygar, bad dudes, castlevania
i dont know why every game company feels they have to remake everything in 3d
look at bionic commando
rearmed was better than the crappy "next gen" sequel that they put out
@Thunder
I own Buzz! Its a blast if you like trivia. I have downloaded all of the expansion for it too. Cartoon and Video Game categories were a great addition. Most of the ppl I play games with prefer SceneIt on my 360 just because I stomp them at general knowledge. The game has lots of character also. The announcer is funny and the graphics are actually damn good. I don't do much online competition though. And the single player experience is a bit disappointing, but if you have 2-4 willing to play its worth it.
@Thunder, you do have a point man
@Slicky, I hear you. I will say though I made fun of Windwaker constantly until I played it. I was converted in a matter of 20 minutes. I thought maybe we have discussed this before but I wasn't sure if you ever gave it a chance.
The Legend of Zelda: A link to the Past was THE BEST ZELDA.
God I love that game slick. it's tough because I didn't truly appreciate it until I was older (I was a little young to be really good at it when it came out) so Ocarina of Time was the first Zelda I beat when I was 11-12 but I went back to the SNES one not long after to finish it. I always liked a Link to the Past even though I sucked at it when I was a kid
i wish they still made 2D sidescrollers too..
@Shockwave
Yeah we talked about it a while back, but I own windwaker. I gave it a chance. I think I made 2-3 boat rides across the damned ocean. Got to several different Islands. I learned some spells. But I just couldn't get into it.
@ray
when i click ads do i actually have to play the horrible games?
whats the minimum i have to do for you to get paid?
@Cornflake
I know 3 friends who NEVER play their Wiis anymore. They do however pull them out when everyone is drunk for some Punch-Out or carnival games.
Shadow Complex… one of the best 2D scrollers I have played in years.
@Slicky, I probably spent like 30-40 hours on Wind Waker but it annoyed me because I bet 20-25 of that was just sailing to another Island. if the cartoons didn't throw you off the flooded Hyrule definitely would. I'll give you that
@thunder, he can't talk about it. just click a couple when you go to the site
Anyone been playing Uncharted 2????
ya slick the single player is f'n amazing, see my comment above. uncharted 1 doesn't even compare
It made me literally laugh out loud last night. I think its in Chapter 6 when you are heading to a high point in the city. Just before you come to the area that everyone showed as a preview for the game there is a swimming pool. If you jump in and swim for a minute or so, you'll get two $5,000 bonuses and here some really lame jokes.
Also, on Zelda I thought Twighlight princess was pretty cool but it's not the 'grown up' Zelda game I yearned for for so long. at it's heart it was definitely still for a younger generation. 12-18 at most. I enjoyed playing it but I hated the whole turning in to a dog thing.
Ya I think I got one of the jokes but I don't know if I hung around for the second one. I love how Drake humors himself during the game. It makes me laugh because I would totally do the same thing if I was on that adventure
@slickyfats
make it 4 because the only time i pull out the wiimotes is when i'm intoxicated with friends too >_<
My only gripe about Uncharted 2 is that they did something to the climbing controls. Sometimes it can be very very hard to make Nathan jump sideways while on a ledge, he just wants to jump up a lot. I rotated the stick every direction and finally had to just drop off and die and try it again.
I will admit slick the climbing is not nearly as fluid as something like assassin's creed Drake tends to make some really awkward movements before I get him to jump where I want him to go. I think part of this is because the platforming is pretty linear in nature. there's really only one way to go when you climb most of the time
I also thought Infamous had a lot more fluid climbing motions than Uncharted does. but again, this was free form platforming and not linear
if you think about it, the wii has really taken the wind out of the sails of console wars.. i think that the wii is only going to slow down the growth of the PS3 and 360 because instead of those two trying to innovate, they're merely imitating with motion controls that neither of the core gaming groups really care for.. in fact, i would even dare to say that motion controls are exactly what PS3 and 360 gamers are trying to escape from. Damn it nintendo, even in success you eff things up for gamers!
Even the games that are good on the system are remakes of previous games. Yea, all games are the same after so long, BUT Nintendo likes to reuse the same formula over and over. They did not do much to Metroid after the move to FPS style games, Zelda is just a rehashed version of the previous games as well. Hell, the new Zelda was for the LAST system, so we STILL have not seen a WII Zelda. Smash Brothers is almost the same as the previous version, slightly updated. They even decided to remake games from previous one of their previous systems to include Wii controls. They might be making assloads of money, but people will soon start to see that if it is not designed by Nintendo, it probably sucks. even the games that are more for the gamers have crappy reviews.
I bought a Wii 4 months after it was released. My wife was quite proud of getting the only system due to the lady who had come in before her by 5 min wanting to go make sure her husband wanted the system(guess he shoulda come in to the store) We played it for a few months, but after a while, it got old. Now it pretty much sits and collects dust. My 4 year old girl loves the system and is learning to play it, but even SHE wants to play the games I have on my 360 more then she does the Wii.
The only thing holding me back from getting a Wii is the price. The Wii does not feel like enough of an improvement over the Gamecube to warrant a $200-$250 price tag. Honestly, the original Xbox has better graphics than the Wii and it launched at $200. You can't use game as an excuse for a higher price either, because we pay for those separately. Now if Nintendo sold the Wii with lets say Twilight Princess, I might be able to justify the $200 price point. I don't hate Nintendo, but it is kind of hard to stand up for a company that you don't see value in their products.
And what about rumors of the Wii HD? If they DO upgrade the system, I know they wont get any more money from me, I feel duped by them already, and anyone who buys a Wii, and a new system comes out within a year or so will just piss them off more.
@Hrolf, Actually, I would like to see a wii that offers the graphics that the Xbox and PS3 do. I think that would be a step for them. it might be too late though. Also, I would like to see the motion controls improved if they're going to stay with that
Is it me, or do most of the "hardcore" games on the Wii feel like a shoddy attempt at make-up sex?
back from toys r us
they didnt have nba 2k10
had to get fight night 4
but im thinking about driving to another toys r us and exchanging that one for 2k10
lol @ Nightshade. crappy make up sex where your too drunk really to enjoy it maybe.
@Hrolf: EXACTLY.
hmm theres no reason for them to go HD because they realized that they would never be at par with the graphics of the PS3 or 360. on top of that, the price would go up from $250 and then there would really be no reason to buy the wii when you could by a PS3/360 for almost [if not] the same price.
yay! they have 2k10 in annapolis, md
ill just stick with fnr4
@cornflake, I don't see the system costing much more than it is now. frankly at 200 I think the wii is overpriced. you can get the HD 360 arcade for the same price. I bet this late in the game Nintendo could compete with the prices of Sony and MS if they made an HD system
@cornflake
there is no reason to go hd cause the kiddies and the elderly who use the damn wii dont give a rats ass about graphics…50 million sold and counting with sd graphics. Explaining graphics to your grandmother is like trying to explain to an eggplant (not leahy) how a telephone works
I agree they don't need HD to sell to their target audience. but if they want core gamers back they better come up with an HD solution in the next few years. Casual gaming is a fad if you ask me
I just think the wii is just too gimmicky. Their peripherals are getting out of control and the games are 4/5 of the time shovelware. I don't mind that they don't have the same graphics as the 360 or ps3 but at least get some more decent games out there.
I hear the tokz.. lunch time!! brb
agreed tokz.. the games are shovelware. with motion controls I can't think of a single wii game that has the substance to match a game like fallout 3 or mass effect.
@shockwave
nintendo is all about making money, they dont give a damn who they sell their systems to, as long as it sells. Nintendo is like pixar, they could release any steaming pile of crap they wanted to and it would still 50 mill. Nintendo realizes that there isnt as much money in the hardcore market as there is in the youth market. This is why a band like tool could never sell as much as n sync could. Children and tweens dictate what sells nowadays. The wii is definitely losing momentum, but ill bet you nintendo already has the next juggernaut planned
Thanks @ conrflake and nightshade.
I'm off too. I'm going to head off to the DMV and go re-new my license.
Have a great weekend!
i butchered post 47
im tired
There are not many games that can compare to the substance of Fallout 3 though. I am STILL finding new stuff. I think they should do one more DLC, add about 30 new weapons in the game, maybe caravan guard missions to go to several locations, and the ability to customize your weapons using some of the stuff you collect through the game thinking you can use for something later ,but you really cant.
Crap I misspelled cornflake. Sorry lousy iPhone didn't correct me that time!
no one tell tokz that he can do that online
I heat you Thunder money sells.. so if Raymond is wondering.. that's why we hate the Wii. They have abandoned the core audience for money. even though Sony and MS sell out they still cater to the core gamers to keep us happy. we built their damn gaming empires.
Throwing me a metroid/Zelda/Mario bone every 2 to 3 years isn't exactly showing the love for your core audience Nintendo
#53 Heat = Hear… I'm tired too
good article here for anyone who wants to remember the glory days of Nintendo. definitely some good nostalgia here. they haven't finished the list yet so you'll have to check back
http://www.ign.com/top-100-nes-games/
@ thundercracker
I can't do it online. I have to take the written test and road test again.
:(
waiting at the office now…. Come on no long wait for the road test!
Wii hate stems from people who like nintendo products getting the shaft from them. I'm not talking about the casual gamer market phenom. I'm talking about delaying and releasing titles that haven't changed in at least 10 years. Examples would be Mario Kart and Smash Bros. There is absolutely no difference between the gamecube, or N64 versions of those games.
Though Nintendo has put out two of the best games this generation: Super Mario Galaxy and Twilight Princess. Those are great.
Twilight Princess was for the last system. they tacked on Wiimote controls for the Wii..I dont even think the graphics were updated much to show any difference.
not when it comes to my username B-) lol j/k as long as you dont mispell it in some weird way like "cinnamon toast crunch" or "cheerios" .. "corn pops" "count chocula" .. anyway you get the point.
@Hrolf – Twilight Princess is one of the best looking games on the wii unfortunately. I don't think the Wii has any superiority in graphics compared to the gamecube. if they wanted to they could have released the latest Smash Brothers and Mario Kart for the Gamecube. hell, they probably could have found a way to do Mario Galaxies too too
I like Count Chocula.. best part of October
@shockwave
duck tales and rc pro am better be on that list
im glad faxanadu and tmnt were on it though
tmnt got a bad rap, i loved that it was so difficult
@shockwave
franken berry is better
cereal flame war?
@thundercracker
I still fear the water level. Those damn bombs and that pink shit!
lol, I'm down thunder. though I haven't had fraken berry in a long time so I may need to pick it up. flame on.
TMNT did get a bad rap. it was that stupid angry nintendo nerd. challenging game though, even today
haha smartguy. I always wanted to get to the car part so bad. I almost pissed myelf as a kid trying to get through the water level. lol. I got pretty good at it though
no one starts a cereal flame war but ME!! blasphemy!!
A cereal flame war. I guess I am lame then. Basic 4!!!
Man, I love Fruity Pebbles. Is that the same as supporting the Wii during a console flamewar?
*joke*
@Nightshade386 Love the cheating girlfriend analogy!
@Thundercracker Buzz is a big hit with my non-gamer friends. Also, I miss 2D games a ton, which is why I love all the retro classics on PSN, XBLA, Wii, etc. As for modern games, SFIV is a 2D fighter that's pretty excellent.
@Shockwave562 Don't you think the releases of Mario, Zelda, Metroid, etc. are pretty the same frequency as the previous two generations? If so, I don't think you can really call than an abandonment.
true Ray.. I think maybe I'm just growing up and Mario and Zelda don't do it for me anymore. who knows.
I consider myself a packrat as far as games and tech goes. I still have MY nintendo…sadly lost the box during Katrina. I have every system I ever owned still except my Jaguar (i wish i still had it, Predator game was great) and my Genesis. I parted with the Jaguar because….well…I don't remember why really. So stupid…like when I sold all my DC games for beer money.
This past weekend my friends and I were playing WCW vs NWO Revenge. We still game in retro fashion!
Though I am super psyched about Earthworm Jim being redone and released on the new consoles. Day one buy guaranteed.
What I don't get about the people who hate on Nintendo sticking with their franchises are the same ones who will rush out and buy Gran Turismo or a Twisted Metal or something. Sony is doing the same thing and MS is not an angel either. I know I was complaining about Nintendo releasing the same games earlier but I meant it literally…THE SAME GAMES.
SMG was great. Truly the best platformer I have ever played. It was different.
As long as Mario and Zelda add new elements while abandoning antiquated fixtures of the series I will continue to support them. I don't always have to play an M rated game haha.
Nintendo turns us all into John Cusack from High Fidelity. "Top five ttings I miss about Nintendo! 1…."
@ray
i guess you are what you eat HA!
No hardcore gamer takes motion controls seriously.
Go Giants.
@oOcornflakeOo Fruity Pebbles is a fine cereal! Hmph. Frosted Mini Wheats would be my close second.
@RROD Do you think that will change? A lot of developers that make "hardcore" games are down with motion controls. It looks like Natal and EyeWand will have some interesting software.
@Smartguy
The difference is Gran Tursimo is always Gran Turismo and Twisted Metal is alway Twisted Metal. But with Mario, there's:
Super Mario Bros.
Super Smash Bros. Brawl
Mario Party
Mario Golf
Mario Tennis
Mario Galaxy
Mario Sluggers
Dr. Mario
Mario Kart
Mario Paint
Mario is Missing
Mario the Juggler
Mario teaches typing
Mario's Bombs Away
Mario's Cement Factory
Mario's Time Machine
Mario & Wario
Super Mario Allstars
Mario's Early Years
Hotel Mario
Mario Clash
Super Mario RPG
Mario Excite Bike
Paper Mario
Mario Sunshine
Dance Dance Revolution Mario Mix
Mario Superstar Baseball
Mario & Luigi: Partners in Crime
Mario & Sonic at the Olympics
Paper Mario Kart
Those are all real games dude.
@Raymond Padilla
No, I don't think that will change. Devs will implement motion controls in hardcore games about the same way Sony did with the sixaxis. I don't think any dev would be foolish enough to make one of their proven franchises fully motion controlled. I turn off the sixaxis and I will turn off the Sone Sphere controls too.
@RROD
You made up some games in that list.
@RROD
Spinoffs and carbon copies are two totally different points. Mario Kart is the same mario kart no matter what. Yet they still keep popping it out and people still buy it.
Not knocking GT. I plan on buying it again if and when a new one ever comes out.
Never was a twisted metal fan. Glad that series is put to bed. (i hope anyway)
GEAUX BEARS!
This site wasn't loading for me this morning, so I went to bed. I woke up and it's running fine now.
I just got COD4 for Mac so I'll probably be playing that. Unless by some miracle I come up on a points card. Then I'll get the Fallout 3 DLC I need and finish that up.
@N8R Yeah, my dad noticed that too. Must've been really early though, because it was fine around 9AM PST for me.
@ R Pad
It was early. It was around 5:30 PST.
@sandrock323
Why must you always doubt me?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_games
@ RROD and Sandrock
Apparently, there was a Mario game in '94 called "Manhole"
(snicker, snicker)